Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

KZR · 2010-10-09 19:10:27

As mentioned in another thread, i'll be posting some prototype zones, with ripped graphics usage ranging from none to very few. most bricks and background parts are either done by myself or reused/edited from free graphics. ripped graphics act as placeholders for user-made or royalty-free graphics, and are the closest match to what i'd like them to look.

As the game itself, my prototypes are open, meaning anyone can edit, build over, or even scrap and build from scratch. this applies not only to the level, but also to the background, to the bricks and to the music.
this is just an effort towards the "originalization" of open surge.

If anyone would like to build their own prototypes, but lacks graphic skills, i can help you putting together a brick set and a background made of free/original graphics.

if you change this prototype please post the modified version for the community to play, evaluate, and improve.

this proto includes:

- most rings (there is still space for more)
- some blue rings
- SilverstepP's Boost rings
- ssdw's seesaw (old version with new gfx)
- basic pipe system
- most loops working flawlessly (there are still a few bugs)
- speed pads by wrath1138
- bugs! lol - not too many though

does not include:

- baddies
- anything else i may have forgotten, and you may fill in

since the level requires many third-party objects, the download link will only be available after i get the ok to bundle them from:

SilverstepP - OK
ssdw - OK
wrath1138 - Pending

until then, screenies:

2 layers of grass

Log bridge

Boost ring & Speedpad

Chains of boost rings taking you to other places

wooden bridge

rocks & foliage around loops (bad tiling being fixed)

underground & seesaw

Last edited by KZR (2010-10-11 19:43:31)

ssdw · 2010-10-09 19:48:29

The screenshots look great
I can't wait!

Of course you get my ok .
all the objects I've made or are going to make, are free for everyone.
I do have a request, change the name of WIP... to something else.

SilverstepP · 2010-10-10 01:59:42

Yay for muh boost rings!

And the level looks nice, except the ground. Its all clipped and distorted in that loop. Can you fix that?

KZR · 2010-10-10 02:31:18

SilverstepP wrote:

Yay for muh boost rings!
And the level looks nice, except the ground. Its all clipped and distorted in that loop. Can you fix that?"

most of what's in the screenshots has been changed/improved since i posted, so, yes, all tiling errors can and will be fixed

SilverstepP · 2010-10-10 13:20:48

KZR wrote:

SilverstepP wrote:
Yay for muh boost rings!
And the level looks nice, except the ground. Its all clipped and distorted in that loop. Can you fix that?"
most of what's in the screenshots has been changed/improved since i posted, so, yes, all tiling errors can and will be fixed

Could you make the brick dimensions multiples of 8? That would allow them to fit the grid, and then it would look VERY beautiful.

KZR · 2010-10-10 15:10:10

SilverstepP wrote:

Could you make the brick dimensions multiples of 8? That would allow them to fit the grid, and then it would look VERY beautiful.

they are all multiples of 8, usually 16*16 as minimum size. the problem you saw in the screenshots was not related to the grid. Apparently the previous bricks (before screens) were seamless even when overlapped, so brick position was not important when covering gaps.
the new texture of the loops (rocky) is a 64*64 brick that is only seamless when placed exactly at the same level as the previous one, horizontally or vertically.
i figured splitting it into smaller 16*16 tiles would be the way to go, and it was only half the way, because now i have micro gaps of 8 sq. pixels. but i have figured a way to get rid of them

Yesterday's improvements:

don't mind the gaps for now, do you see how it tiles nicely now?

new details on dirt bricks

new cloud type bricks

SilverstepP · 2010-10-10 15:25:38

As this contains no download link, I moved it to general discussion.

Besides, we're still generally discussing it, aren't we. :-p

Can you fix those loop pieces, they still look very clipped...

KZR · 2010-10-10 15:57:06

i'm just waiting for wrath's answer to post the link.

everything can be fixed even if it means redoing stuff.

Alexandre · 2010-10-10 16:46:35

Awesome. Thanks for helping us out, KZR.

As mentioned in another thread, i'll be posting some prototype zones, with ripped graphics usage ranging from none to very few

That's a bit of a concern, meaning that it would be hard to use it even as a base idea. I'd suggest mentioning in a readme.txt which graphics are ripped (so we can stay away from them), or even better, getting rid of the ripped content completely.

The screenies look very nice and I can't wait to play. I understand this is a prototype level and I appreciate it, but for the final zone I suggest using more hot, vivid, tropical colors (yellow, orange...), since the level is called Sunshine Paradise.

As for the loops, it seems that it's giving some headaches to the level designers. A suggestion for a one-weekend project (for anyone who might be interested) is to create a template loop (with no texture) that fits the grid. Pretty much like the one below:

In fact, this is a group of items/bricks that is equivalent to:

Not only it would fix all the movement bugs, but it would also fix all the clipping problems, since the designer/artist would have only to texture the image using GIMP, Photoshop or something like that. No need to align triangles by hand. This grid-compatible loop template could be packed into a group and shared with the community, so everyone would benefit.

SilverstepP · 2010-10-10 17:12:47

Alexandre wrote:

Awesome. Thanks for helping us out, KZR.
As mentioned in another thread, i'll be posting some prototype zones, with ripped graphics usage ranging from none to very few
That's a bit of a concern, meaning that it would be hard to use it even as a base idea. I'd suggest mentioning in a readme.txt which graphics are ripped (so we can stay away from them), or even better, getting rid of the ripped content completely.
The screenies look very nice and I can't wait to play. I understand this is a prototype level and I appreciate it, but for the final zone I suggest using more hot, vivid, tropical colors (yellow, orange...), since the level is called Sunshine Paradise.
As for the loops, it seems that it's giving some headaches to the level designers. A suggestion for a one-weekend project (for anyone who might be interested) is to create a template loop (with no texture) that fits the grid. Pretty much like the one below:
In fact, this is a group of items/bricks that is equivalent to:
Not only it would fix all the movement bugs, but it would also fix all the clipping problems, since the designer/artist would have only to texture the image using GIMP, Photoshop or something like that. No need to align triangles by hand. This grid-compatible loop template could be packed into a group and shared with the community, so everyone would benefit.

I've been making this already. It's almost done.

KZR · 2010-10-10 18:02:51

Alexandre wrote:

That's a bit of a concern, meaning that it would be hard to use it even as a base idea. I'd suggest mentioning in a readme.txt which graphics are ripped (so we can stay away from them), or even better, getting rid of the ripped content completely.

don't worry. i know exactly which ones are ripped. currently only trees, foliage and placeable grass are ripped. trees in the background are not, however
it seems i have strayed a bit from the concept, fortunately this brickset can be used for dark forest with minimal changes (mostly recoloring). in fact i may change this proto to that zone and start a new one for sunshine paradise since it currently fits in the dark forest theme better. the background can have some changes too, like replacing those pines and oaks with palms and tropical plants, and giving it some warm colors in the mix.

as for loops you just gave me a great idea. i can copy the template loop and loop group to new files and include the group in my theme. or even use the loop template and then copy the new bricks to my brickset. i'll see into that later on today. thanks for your help too, Alexandre

TheSeventhEmerald · 2010-10-11 13:48:57

Get my ok. This look awesome!

KZR · 2010-10-11 20:56:48

TheSeventhEmerald wrote:

Get my ok. This look awesome!

did you do those speedpads?

OK, on to updates

like said before, i was going the wrong way, making a forest level instead of a tropical level. the wrong way to Sunshine Paradise led me to the right path to Dark Forest
this was actually good. the old version was stored for mr. Just-In Case, but there was a great change.

i guess screens speak for themselves:

What's this? Guess and win a FREE cookie

it's a log cannon, and requires all 3 to operate

Darker Pallete + background modifications

Knux climbing some trees

Bricks and Background blend very naturally

Finish sign covered in grass & some blue grass growing

more tomorrow

ssdw · 2010-10-11 21:17:16

Now there are even tunnels.
it gets better and better .
When will you release this level?

SilverstepP · 2010-10-11 21:40:58

KZR wrote:

What's this? Guess and win a FREE cookie

Lol. Internet cookies or homemade cookies?

I can help with the cannon. I can make a random event pipe object that has a 50 percent chance of sending you left and a 50 percent chance of sending you right. It isn't hard. I've made quite a few now (Which I STILL haven't released, unfortunately ) and I believe this could contribute.

However... this picture also furthers my arguement for having the ability to set zindexes on bricks. I can barely see the pipe up icons.

KZR · 2010-10-11 21:56:50

ssdw wrote:

Now there are even tunnels.
it gets better and better
When will you release this level?

i'm waiting for wrath's answer. since he never released the speedpad object outside of "Sonic & the magical stone", i'm not going to do it without his consent. even though it's Open Sonic, i just don't want anyone to feel "ripped".

the only way to get it is to download his game and copy the objects, sprites and images associated with the speedpads into your "normal" Open Sonic, or put my level into s.& t.m.s. folder. your choice.

i'm fixing all loops based on the instructions of Alexandre Sensei so it may take one or two days more.

SilverstepP wrote:

I can help with the cannon. I can make a random event pipe object that has a 50 percent chance of sending you left and a 50 percent chance of sending you right. It isn't hard. I've made quite a few now (Which I STILL haven't released, unfortunately ) and I believe this could contribute.

it has that chance, based on your distance from the pipe center. all it needed was 2 opposite pipe objects at the bottom, side by side and centered inside the log.
that object of yours may be useful for a log maze in act 2

SilverstepP wrote:

I can barely see the pipe up icons.

they were not there yet. but there are a lot of boost rings hidden inside. they weren't needed, but i like how it sounded
maybe i'll make a sound effect for it later.

edit:

Weather Forecast

Rainy all week

EDIT (again):

anyone that can script a boss please let me know so we can discuss that

Last edited by KZR (2010-10-12 00:05:24)

Bertram · 2010-10-12 07:47:21

Hi there,

Nice job so far KZR, I hope wrath will give his ok soon.

Not willing to bother you but keeping in mind some legal problems free games can later have even with free resources (or claimed as, at first), one good way to ensure your licensing is free (or not) could be to add an AUTHORS file in your project, listing for each resources: its name, version, author, author's mail, license, origin (a website, ...).

Just a suggestion taken from personal experience.

Best regards.

KZR · 2010-10-12 13:11:55

Yesterday's update

many changes since last post.

- Since wrath is nowhere to be found, speedpads were removed from this proto. i hope to get in touch with him soon so i can use them in sunshine paradise proto, where i believe they would fit better.

- most loops are now fixed -- angled pieces in correct places, reduced the choppy look with better placement of bricks, bugs , almost non-existent, except some loops that can't handle players running/rolling too fast. all springs that existed before loops were removed to prevent this from happening.

- 2 new passables, 1 of them is a platform on top. screenies to explain:

I'm doing mushrooms
Really, I am, , Pixel mushrooms that is... The bottom is passable, the top has pieces. 45º/ 0º| 315º\. the 0º piece is very thin so you end up sliding to the sides if you're not fast enough to jump somewhere else. this was intended and achieved.

Yet more mushrooms! And rocks!
nothing really exciting about this one. it's just a passable with zindex=1, which means players go behind them. hmm what else can be behind?

Candidate version is only a few hours away from being available for download. remember guys, NO SPEEDPADS in this level. all other custom objects remain. and those do make a difference. speedpads were more cosmetic than useful.

time is ticking... back to work.

ssdw · 2010-10-12 13:29:44

Maby it was a good thing you had no contact with wrath1138.
because the level has improved

KZR · 2010-10-12 14:13:29

ok, besides a boss object, i'd like to include some animated bricks/objects to make the level look more alive.

so, i need talented animators / scripters for:

- Falling leaves - as a brick

- new enemies - as objects, of course.

discussion is open for what the enemies should be.

i'll name a few i'd like:

- frogs - they jump around randomly once every 1/2 seconds
- snakes - they move left-right and walk on angles, they don't drop off ledges
- spiders - they move up/down on a thread. all directions on a web.
- wolves - they run around and jump towards the player in 32px. X and 16px Y, and they only do it when between 1 to 32px. away from player. takes 2 hits to disappear, and bounces back on the 1st one
- bats - they just fly around and/or hang on trees / bricks upside down. maybe a separate object for bat hanging spot is needed.
- bears - they're big! (96 sq px. max) and they take 3 hits to disappear. they walk around on 4's, and stand up to attack. they bounce back when hit

don't worry about sprites. if you can't draw or find free graphics for the enemies, just leave the frames blank, or make a stick figure representing the desired animation. we'll fill them out later.

I expect to put the download link today, so you'll get a chance to test them in their habitat

Also i'd like to remember everyone that if this prototype comes to pass into OPEN SURGE 0.1.5, so will your objects, art, sounds etc. so, the best efforts get a nice reward (sorry no cookies this time)

ssdw · 2010-10-12 14:32:09

I can help!
I am bad at design, but I can create objects (enemy's).
say what I can do, and I go to work

KZR · 2010-10-12 14:45:46

well i suggest using one of the enemy objects from 0.1.4 and adding them the properties i mentioned and any other you find interesting. i found some free sprites for most of those animals and i'm going to adapt them to custom sheets.

meanwhile you can test with the sprites included in 0.1.4

snakes can be made from those small badniks that look like spiders, or from any other that walks sideways.
bats from the guys with jetpacks
wolves from tin men

etc. just pick one with the closest behaviour and add more to it according to the animal.

ssdw · 2010-10-12 14:59:50

KZR wrote:

well i suggest using one of the enemy objects from 0.1.4 and adding them the properties i mentioned and any other you find interesting. i found some free sprites for most of those animals and i'm going to adapt them to custom sheets.
meanwhile you can test with the sprites included in 0.1.4
snakes can be made from those small badniks that look like spiders, or from any other that walks sideways.
bats from the guys with jetpacks
wolves from tin men
etc. just pick one with the closest behaviour and add more to it according to the animal.

okey, I will .
I'll go work on the first of the list, the frog.
It is an easy enemy to make.

I have an idea for an enemy.
the level looks a bit like a jungle, So I thought of a monkey.
a monkey hanging from a tree and banana throws to the player.
if the player touches the banana, the player lost his ring.
it's just an idea!

Alexandre · 2010-10-12 15:34:17

Great stuff.

KZR wrote:

it's a log cannon, and requires all 3 to operate

Cool, but let's not forget the game story. In the beginning of black forest, surge starts by himself. Black Forest is the place where Charge is being held captive. Neon does not appear until dragon egg zone.

Bertram wrote:

Hi there,
Nice job so far KZR, I hope wrath will give his ok soon.
Not willing to bother you but keeping in mind some legal problems free games can later have even with free resources (or claimed as, at first), one good way to ensure your licensing is free (or not) could be to add an AUTHORS file in your project, listing for each resources: its name, version, author, author's mail, license, origin (a website, ...).
Just a suggestion taken from personal experience.
Best regards.

I totally agree. We do not want legal issues for Open Surge.

SilverstepP · 2010-10-12 15:36:33

Alexandre wrote:

Great stuff.
KZR wrote:
it's a log cannon, and requires all 3 to operate
Cool, but let's not forget the game story. In the beginning of black forest, surge starts by himself. Black Forest is the place where Charge is being held captive. Neon does not appear until dragon egg zone.

Well, it shouldn't be hard to modify it, right?

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#1 2010-10-09 19:10:27

Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#2 2010-10-09 19:48:29

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#3 2010-10-10 01:59:42

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#4 2010-10-10 02:31:18

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#5 2010-10-10 13:20:48

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#6 2010-10-10 15:10:10

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#7 2010-10-10 15:25:38

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#8 2010-10-10 15:57:06

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#9 2010-10-10 16:46:35

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#10 2010-10-10 17:12:47

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#11 2010-10-10 18:02:51

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#12 2010-10-11 13:48:57

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#13 2010-10-11 20:56:48

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#14 2010-10-11 21:17:16

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#15 2010-10-11 21:40:58

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#16 2010-10-11 21:56:50

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#17 2010-10-12 07:47:21

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#18 2010-10-12 13:11:55

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#19 2010-10-12 13:29:44

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#20 2010-10-12 14:13:29

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#21 2010-10-12 14:32:09

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#22 2010-10-12 14:45:46

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#23 2010-10-12 14:59:50

Re: Dark Forest Prototype WIP (prev. Sunshine Paradise Prototype)

#24 2010-10-12 15:34:17

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